Expansion Discussion Thread

[claphamsa]

Altho I am in favor of anything that complicates things for New Jersey  

I still get irritated when I see this... then realize im WV here

[24Rocks]

Altho I am in favor of anything that complicates things for New Jersey  

I agree with this 100% plus it gives that lucky team a chance to play in a playoff game for the 4th spot

[mstreeter06]

AFBL will go ahead with the two-divisions of five teams per league setup for the 2017 and beyond with 14 votes cast.

[mstreeter06]

Vote for how the AFBL will format its playoffs with 20 teams. Any thoughts/opinions? Thanks!

[mstreeter06]

Bump for our continued discussion for expansion and currently how we'll format our playoffs.

[BaseballAddict32]

just wanted to drop the topic of expansion draft in here. how many players can be protected and such and what rules will apply so as this season quickly develops expansion teams can do some advance scouting. after not paying the scouting department the big bucks for nothing LOL

[mstreeter06]

Items Needed To Be Decided On (11/19/13):
-number of protected players per team?
-auto-protect players with less than X Pro Service Years?
-limit of picks from a single team?
-actual draft process?
-is there a need to generate extra free agents or draft picks to help fill out minors? Teams technically don't need a full roster in each minor league level. If so, how should we go about doing this (add to FA pool after Expansion Draft and Amateur Draft? Separate FA Draft?)

I'll keep this updated as needed.

Here's what I'm thinking about but still is up for discussion...

Amount of protected player per team? 10-20 range
Auto-protect players with less than X Pro Service Years Off or 1
Limit of players picked per team? 10-15 range
Actual draft process? Still TBD but protection lists exported in the game (maybe?) then held in the forum with a Google Spreadsheet to keep track of the protection list and player pullbacks after a selection from that team

In the NPBL, they had a system that allowed a team to pull back 2-3 players after a player was selected in the Expansion Round. It's a good point that allows the 16 current teams some strategy to protect additional players after losing someone.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

[NorseKaiser]

For the "pullback" option- how does that work in real time? Would every pick need to be followed by a window where the original team could pull a player back? If so, that could take a long time...

[mstreeter06]

For the "pullback" option- how does that work in real time? Would every pick need to be followed by a window where the original team could pull a player back? If so, that could take a long time...

I need to check with Chappy about how this happened when NPBL went through this. I wasn't involved when it happened so I'm curious too haha.

[Ohio GM]

For the "pullback" option- how does that work in real time? Would every pick need to be followed by a window where the original team could pull a player back? If so, that could take a long time...

I need to check with Chappy about how this happened when NPBL went through this. I wasn't involved when it happened so I'm curious too haha.

Matt - the whole threads are still there for the drafting process when we did it in the NPBL.

[Ohio GM]

For the "pullback" option- how does that work in real time? Would every pick need to be followed by a window where the original team could pull a player back? If so, that could take a long time...

The way we did the draft in the NPBL, the expansion teams could only pick one person from each team ( i.e. you could only lose one per round).  Then there would be a tread for each team to protect two more players, and round two would happen.

Below were the rules:

===============================

?Each division will add 1 team, so the FFL and GEL will each be made up of 2 7-team divisions.
?The new teams will begin play in the 2027 season.
?The amatuer draft will be extended to 5 rounds (generate 6) for the 2027, 2028, 2029, 2030 and 2031 seasons.  There will be an adjustment made to the incoming talent so that we won't have too many talented players in the league afterwords.
?The expansion teams will first be opened to current owners, before being offered to the general public.  If more than 4 current owners want expansion teams, we would assign the teams based on who has the longest NPBL tenure.  Owners will be announced late 2026, most likely just after the trade deadline.
?The expansion teams will only draft from teams in their respective league, and each current team will lose 5 players, giving each expansion team 30 players + their 5 draft picks and any signed free agents.
?The expansion teams will pick between the non-playoff and playoff teams during the 2027 amatuer draft.
?Each current team would protect 15 players, then 3 more after each of the remainding 'rounds'.  Each team would lose exactly one player per 'round'.  The number of pullbacks could be adjusted on a team-by-team basis if the club has fewer than 32 eligible players, but in the end, each team will lose exactly 5 players.
?Players drafted in 2023 or later and have fewer than 172 days (1 year) of Big-League Service will not be eligible for the draft. 
?The expansion draft (there will really be two, one per league) will consist of 5 rounds, with each team losing 1 player per round.  Who picks first in each round would look like this:

Round 1 - Team X
Round 2 - Team Y
Round 3 - Team Y
Round 4 - Team X
Round 5 - Team Y

[BaseballAddict32]

Items Needed To Be Decided On (11/19/13):
-number of protected players per team?
-auto-protect players with less than X Pro Service Years?
-limit of picks from a single team?
-actual draft process?
-is there a need to generate extra free agents or draft picks to help fill out minors? Teams technically don't need a full roster in each minor league level. If so, how should we go about doing this (add to FA pool after Expansion Draft and Amateur Draft? Separate FA Draft?)

I'll keep this updated as needed.

Here's what I'm thinking about but still is up for discussion...

Amount of protected player per team? 10-20 range
Auto-protect players with less than X Pro Service Years Off or 1
Limit of players picked per team? 10-15 range
Actual draft process? Still TBD but protection lists exported in the game (maybe?) then held in the forum with a Google Spreadsheet to keep track of the protection list and player pullbacks after a selection from that team

In the NPBL, they had a system that allowed a team to pull back 2-3 players after a player was selected in the Expansion Round. It's a good point that allows the 16 current teams some strategy to protect additional players after losing someone.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

I am against pullback players. It destroys teams drafting from players they think they can get. Only to after teams behind them picked, lose that player. Expansion teams are already playing catch up. To have the draft disrupted by taking a guy and being told no, you can't have him later is IMO anyway disruptive to any strategy for the drafting teams. Easier to just protect 2-3 more players.

[mikezone13]

I like what Ohio GM posted, well some aspects any way.

- No team loses more than player per round
- Guys with less than 1 ML service year are protected
- All current teams lose the same amount of players across the expansion draft
- Each current team would protect 15 players, then 3 more after each of the remaining 'rounds'.

On matt's original post, 10 protected players is too few, while 20 protected players is too many start with as there will just be a big bunch of unprotected relievers

I also like the idea in addition to the service time clause that anyone aged 25y/o or over and NOT on the 25 man roster is fair game. So this means if you have some guys in their late 20's in the minors who are actually decent ML level, they get in the draft pool regardless of service time.

[Ohio GM]

Here was the way Baseball did it in 1997 :

====================
Similar to the 1992 expansion draft, both expansion teams selected 35 players.[4] The draft was divided into three rounds. Each team would select 14 players in round 1, 14 players in round 2, and 7 players in round 3. Tampa Bay general manager Chuck LaMar and Arizona general manager Joe Garagiola, Jr. oversaw their teams' selections.
The Devil Rays and Diamondbacks could pick any player not on the protected lists of the 28 other teams, although no team could lose more than one player in a given round. The protected list for each team consisted of:
For the first round, 15 players from the rosters of their entire organization?both their 40-man roster, plus all minor league affiliates.[4]
Each team could add three more players to its protected list after each round.[4]
In addition to the above, players chosen in the 1996 and 1997 amateur drafts were automatically protected, plus players who were 18 or younger when signed in 1995.
Players who were free agents after the end of the 1997 season need not be protected.
As with the 1992 expansion draft, the order was determined by a coin toss. The winner of the toss could choose either: (a) The first overall pick in the expansion draft or (b) allow the other team to pick first and receive both the second and third overall expansion draft picks and the right to pick first in the subsequent rounds of the expansion draft. Tampa Bay won the toss and chose to select first.

[mstreeter06]

I like what Ohio GM posted, well some aspects any way.

- No team loses more than player per round
- Guys with less than 1 ML service year are protected
- All current teams lose the same amount of players across the expansion draft
- Each current team would protect 15 players, then 3 more after each of the remaining 'rounds'.

On matt's original post, 10 protected players is too few, while 20 protected players is too many start with as there will just be a big bunch of unprotected relievers

I also like the idea in addition to the service time clause that anyone aged 25y/o or over and NOT on the 25 man roster is fair game. So this means if you have some guys in their late 20's in the minors who are actually decent ML level, they get in the draft pool regardless of service time.

Here was the way Baseball did it in 1997 :

====================
Similar to the 1992 expansion draft, both expansion teams selected 35 players.[4] The draft was divided into three rounds. Each team would select 14 players in round 1, 14 players in round 2, and 7 players in round 3. Tampa Bay general manager Chuck LaMar and Arizona general manager Joe Garagiola, Jr. oversaw their teams' selections.
The Devil Rays and Diamondbacks could pick any player not on the protected lists of the 28 other teams, although no team could lose more than one player in a given round. The protected list for each team consisted of:
For the first round, 15 players from the rosters of their entire organization?both their 40-man roster, plus all minor league affiliates.[4]
Each team could add three more players to its protected list after each round.[4]
In addition to the above, players chosen in the 1996 and 1997 amateur drafts were automatically protected, plus players who were 18 or younger when signed in 1995.
Players who were free agents after the end of the 1997 season need not be protected.
As with the 1992 expansion draft, the order was determined by a coin toss. The winner of the toss could choose either: (a) The first overall pick in the expansion draft or (b) allow the other team to pick first and receive both the second and third overall expansion draft picks and the right to pick first in the subsequent rounds of the expansion draft. Tampa Bay won the toss and chose to select first.

I like some sort of combination between these two processes for our expansion draft...

-No team loses more than 1 player per round
-Players with less than 1 ML service year are auto-protected (add an age limit plus not on 25-man roster provision?)
-Players selected in the (?2014 and?) 2015 Amateur Draft are auto-protected
-Current teams can lose no more than ?10? players (TBD, should every current team lose the same amount of players?)
-Current teams protect 15 players (?then 2-3 more after each Expansion Draft Round?)