Expansion

[mstreeter06]

This has always been an interesting discussion in previous Winter Meetings as I bring it back up. I'd love to get to 24 franchises at some point which has been my ultimate goal for the size of our league. I'm all for going with what the majority of the league is feeling for the direction and timeframe for expansion.

I feel as though there are several different routes and options for this we need decide on...

First, is whether to stagger the 4 expansion franchises into two waves of 2 teams or to add 4 franchises all at once like in 2017.

Second, would be the timeframe to expand... 2027, 2030, 2035, or even further out?

Third, would be the process of the future expansion draft where to use a similar procedure like in 2017 or tweak it?

Discuss your thoughts and opinions below. There won't be poll yet since this topic will take some time to discuss and decide on the best course of action as a league. Thanks guys!

[mikezone13]

What would the playoff implications be of moving to 24 teams?

[mstreeter06]

What would the playoff implications be of moving to 24 teams?

Good question... maybe add a 5th playoff team in each league?

[LT]

I would prefer 2030 at the earliest for expansion. As for methodology - I liked 15 players from each team to get drafted. But would not limit it to one per team per round. If round 1 sees 15 players from team x taken then nobody else can be chosen from that team the rest of the draft.


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[JKGuy16]

Same thing as always for me....

We need to go a few seasons without losing any owners.  These owners need to be active and aren't regularly missing exports.  Any expansion must obviously have enough ready to go owners to cover the slots. 

I'd also like to have a set of rules drawn up at least two seasons prior to the expansion draft.  I think the previous expansion was extremely rocky and some owners may not have been properly prepared for it.

I'm all for expansion happening whenever as long as the league remains strong.

[claphamsa]

never

[Qdog915]

I agree on the set rules on how we are going to expand. A plan we can always use in the future for any kind of expansion/contraction.

How much turnover has their been recently, Matt?

[mstreeter06]

How much turnover has their been recently, Matt?

Not much turnover and I don't foresee any GMs stepping away or going MIA anytime soon.

Brian (NM) joined us in 2022, Dave (WA) joined us in 2023, and Jason (CA) joined us in 2023.

I would like to see a full 4 seasons of zero turnover before we expand like has been expressed in the past. I think if we continue with the group we have for the next several seasons, I would push for expansion in 2030 but likely not earlier. This would give us plenty of time to hammer out the procedures out and have a clearer plan than in 2017 plus allow the future GMs a chance to join the league in votes/participation until expansion occurs.

[Cannon Fodder06]

Same thing as always for me....

We need to go a few seasons without losing any owners.  These owners need to be active and aren't regularly missing exports.  Any expansion must obviously have enough ready to go owners to cover the slots. 

I'd also like to have a set of rules drawn up at least two seasons prior to the expansion draft.  I think the previous expansion was extremely rocky and some owners may not have been properly prepared for it.

I'm all for expansion happening whenever as long as the league remains strong.

I second this

[Ohio GM]

never

never as well.  the last draft gutted my team of any depth

[Steve Wunda]

Same thing as always for me....

We need to go a few seasons without losing any owners.  These owners need to be active and aren't regularly missing exports.  Any expansion must obviously have enough ready to go owners to cover the slots. 

I'd also like to have a set of rules drawn up at least two seasons prior to the expansion draft.  I think the previous expansion was extremely rocky and some owners may not have been properly prepared for it.

I'm all for expansion happening whenever as long as the league remains strong.

I second this

Agree

[Holycow98]

Expansion is one of those things that I've never actually participated in online and I've been playing since OOTP 3. I was a co-commish for awhile back in the OOTP 5-6.5 era and briefly ran the league when the commished stepped down. From that perspective owner turnover would be my #1 concern....I always felt that some guys (as in team owners) feel like lifers (or at least feel like they plan to have a long career in the league) and then some owners gave me a  feeling as soon as their current cycle is over and they need to go from win now to rebuild mode they suddenly become less active and slip away from their team and the league.

I think the timing of expansion would need to be when Matt feels like he has a large enough pool of lifers/long career guys...and possibly also timed with the migration to the latest version of the game at the time so that overall OOTP interest is at a higher point.

From a player standpoint I think expansion can be nice addition to the league (if timed right of course). As far as the expansion of how many playoff teams there will be. I like for it to feel like a accomplishment just to make the playoffs. If I remember correctly when I rejoined the NPBL after a two year or so hiatus...my second year my team made the playoffs with a 80-82 record. We ended up making the FF title game almost making the NPBL title round. It was fun at the time...but looking back....I don't think a sub-.500 team should be a playoff team. I like in the AFBL it feels like more of a accomplishment to make the playoffs. I hope that if we ever expand we don't water down the playoffs too much.

[Chappy]

I would prefer 2030 at the earliest for expansion. As for methodology - I liked 15 players from each team to get drafted. But would not limit it to one per team per round. If round 1 sees 15 players from team x taken then nobody else can be chosen from that team the rest of the draft.


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We wouldn't need to lose that many.

If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 15 players, that would be 75 per expansion franchise.
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 10 players, that would be 50 per expansion franchise. 
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 8 players, that would be 40 per expansion franchise.

There is a sizable free agent pool at the moment that could be used to help fill the minor leagues.

One interesting thing you can do in OOTP that you couldn't do in 6.5 when the NPBL expanded is create the expansion teams a few years early.

So, for example, say the target is to add 4 teams in 2030....
In 2026, create the expansion clubs as unaffiliated minor league teams in a Rookie League.  Let them participate in the draft (might be tricky, you'd most likely have to do this manually) and claim free agents.
In 2027, move those squads up a level to A-ball and create a R-league team for them to use.  Promotions/Demotions would have to be handled manually by the commish since you cannot link squads as far as I know unless they share a parent major league club (and they wouldn't yet).  They draft more players and claim more free agents.
In 2028 move them to AA. Now the organization has AA, A and R-league teams.
In 2029 move them to AAA. Now you have all levels except a big league squad.
In 2030, add the parent clubs... now the minor league teams can be officially linked in-game so Matt has to do less movement.

You could do a much shorter Expansion draft, because these teams would have 4 or 5 drafts under their belts as well as years of FA claims.  All you'd need to do is get them 20-30 players, which could be done with each team only losing 4-6 players. 

[mstreeter06]

I would prefer 2030 at the earliest for expansion. As for methodology - I liked 15 players from each team to get drafted. But would not limit it to one per team per round. If round 1 sees 15 players from team x taken then nobody else can be chosen from that team the rest of the draft.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We wouldn't need to lose that many.

If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 15 players, that would be 75 per expansion franchise.
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 10 players, that would be 50 per expansion franchise. 
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 8 players, that would be 40 per expansion franchise.

There is a sizable free agent pool at the moment that could be used to help fill the minor leagues.

One interesting thing you can do in OOTP that you couldn't do in 6.5 when the NPBL expanded is create the expansion teams a few years early.

So, for example, say the target is to add 4 teams in 2030....
In 2026, create the expansion clubs as unaffiliated minor league teams in a Rookie League.  Let them participate in the draft (might be tricky, you'd most likely have to do this manually) and claim free agents.
In 2027, move those squads up a level to A-ball and create a R-league team for them to use.  Promotions/Demotions would have to be handled manually by the commish since you cannot link squads as far as I know unless they share a parent major league club (and they wouldn't yet).  They draft more players and claim more free agents.
In 2028 move them to AA. Now the organization has AA, A and R-league teams.
In 2029 move them to AAA. Now you have all levels except a big league squad.
In 2030, add the parent clubs... now the minor league teams can be officially linked in-game so Matt has to do less movement.

You could do a much shorter Expansion draft, because these teams would have 4 or 5 drafts under their belts as well as years of FA claims.  All you'd need to do is get them 20-30 players, which could be done with each team only losing 4-6 players.

Oh that's an interesting idea. This is really similar to what I had in mind for that Independent League idea I had a few seasons ago in terms of letting the future expansion franchises gain some history without killing the current league. I'll have to do some testing in a test league with our setup.

[LT]

I would prefer 2030 at the earliest for expansion. As for methodology - I liked 15 players from each team to get drafted. But would not limit it to one per team per round. If round 1 sees 15 players from team x taken then nobody else can be chosen from that team the rest of the draft.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We wouldn't need to lose that many.

If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 15 players, that would be 75 per expansion franchise.
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 10 players, that would be 50 per expansion franchise. 
If each of the 20 existing clubs lost 8 players, that would be 40 per expansion franchise.

There is a sizable free agent pool at the moment that could be used to help fill the minor leagues.

One interesting thing you can do in OOTP that you couldn't do in 6.5 when the NPBL expanded is create the expansion teams a few years early.

So, for example, say the target is to add 4 teams in 2030....
In 2026, create the expansion clubs as unaffiliated minor league teams in a Rookie League.  Let them participate in the draft (might be tricky, you'd most likely have to do this manually) and claim free agents.
In 2027, move those squads up a level to A-ball and create a R-league team for them to use.  Promotions/Demotions would have to be handled manually by the commish since you cannot link squads as far as I know unless they share a parent major league club (and they wouldn't yet).  They draft more players and claim more free agents.
In 2028 move them to AA. Now the organization has AA, A and R-league teams.
In 2029 move them to AAA. Now you have all levels except a big league squad.
In 2030, add the parent clubs... now the minor league teams can be officially linked in-game so Matt has to do less movement.

You could do a much shorter Expansion draft, because these teams would have 4 or 5 drafts under their belts as well as years of FA claims.  All you'd need to do is get them 20-30 players, which could be done with each team only losing 4-6 players.

Great idea - was a lazy post I never bothered with the math, was more a concept - while I did not really benefit from the first pick in each round of the expansion draft I did not like limiting the picks to one per team per round...